Governing a large nation
is like cooking little fish.
When the world is ruled by the Way,
the ghosts are powerless.
It is not that the ghosts are powerless;
their spirits do not harm the people.
Not only do the spirits not harm the people;
sages do not harm the people either.
Because the two do not harm each other,
their virtues ultimately combine.

– Thomas Cleary

 

Ruling a great state
is like cooking a small fish
when you govern the world with the Tao
spirits display no powers
not that they have no powers
their powers don’t harm the people
not that their powers can’t harm
the sages keep them from harming
and neither harms the other
for both rely on Virtue

– Red Pine

 

Rule a great state as you cook a small fish.

Through the Way take a ruler’s place in the world,
And the ghosts of the dead shall have no force.
Is it that they have no force?
Or that their force can do no harm?
That their force can do no harm?
Or that the wise lord does no harm?
Nor ghosts nor wise lord doing harm
To their joint virtue thus redounds.

– Moss Roberts


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#220: The working poor and a so-so murder show Human Voices Wake Us

An episode from 3/9/26: Tonight, I read from Barbara Ehrenreich’s 2001 book Nickle and Dimed: On (Not) Getting by in America. After that, I talk about the recent TV show The Killing, as a way in to talking about our obsession and desire for criticism, objectivity, and certainty. Isn’t privacy and the subjective more fruitful? Both parts of this episode are related to essays in my book Notes from the Grid.What is your equivalent of these passages? Email me or send an audio file to humanvoiceswakeus1@gmail.com, and I may use it in an upcoming episode.The best way to support the podcast is by leaving a review on Apple or Spotify, sharing it with others, or sending me a note on what you think. You can also order any of my books: Time and the River: From Columbine to the Invention of Fire, Notes from the Grid, To the House of the Sun, The Lonely Young & the Lonely Old, and Bone Antler Stone. I've also edited a handful of books in the S4N Pocket Poems series. I also have a YouTube channel where I share poems and excerpts from these books, mostly as YouTube shorts. Email me at humanvoiceswakeus1@gmail.com.
  1. #220: The working poor and a so-so murder show
  2. #219: When a paragraph changes your life
  3. #218: Poetry to Live By
  4. #217: Voices from 1900-1914
  5. #216: Poets, Prophets, Seeresses & Goddesses from Time & the River
  6. #215: 8 Favorite Poems from "Time and the River"
  7. #214: Two of the Best Poems You've Never Heard of (by William Cullen Bryant)
  8. #213: Van Gogh's Early Years
  9. #212: The Most Popular Story in Ancient India
  10. #211: Who Was William Cullen Bryant?

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